176 replies to this topic

[garsh]

Those things are like 3 inches tall, aren't they? I never understood why they decided to call them Minimates. Not only are they about the same size as any other figure, but their stunted proportions make them pretty bulky. What's "mini" about that?

It seems to me that they'll actually be quite a bit larger than real Battle Beasts.

[dankingery]

love the avatar garsh!

minimates are about 2.5". no far off of 3" i guess. just think of them as articulated lego men on with gigantism.

[Articulationnut]

Those things are like 3 inches tall, aren't they? I never understood why they decided to call them Minimates. Not only are they about the same size as any other figure, but their stunted proportions make them pretty bulky. What's "mini" about that?

It seems to me that they'll actually be quite a bit larger than real Battle Beasts.

They are 2'' tall (although a previous version was 3'' tall).

[garsh]

love the avatar garsh!

Thanks! I won that particular Warfang minifigure in a giveaway, and I named him "Harg". He's special to me.

They are 2'' tall (although a previous version was 3'' tall).

That sounds more like it, then. I hope the Ghostbusters are the smaller variety. If it works out, Ghostbusters will be the first Minimates I own. I prefer figures as small as possible.

[Articulationnut]

love the avatar garsh!

Thanks! I won that particular Warfang minifigure in a giveaway, and I named him "Harg". He's special to me.

They are 2'' tall (although a previous version was 3'' tall).

That sounds more like it, then. I hope the Ghostbusters are the smaller variety. If it works out, Ghostbusters will be the first Minimates I own. I prefer figures as small as possible.

You and i both but i still demand "good" articulation. I love art . I love toys. The difference between the 2 (IMO) is playability. Quality articulation adds to the level of enjoyment one can derive from their toy art. I never would have picked up the Marvel Legends Sasquatch figure (from Jkaris heh) if it werent for the articulation despite the fact that i thought the sculpt itself was very attractive. Being able to pose it made the difference between admiring from afar and owning the figure.

[garsh]

You and i both but i still demand "good" articulation.

That's one of the things that disappoints me most about Minimates. They look like they have fantastic articulation, which is the one thing I value most highly -- fixing everything about Lego minifigs that I would have wanted -- but then they ruin it with terrible shapes and a generally over-sized figure.

Based on your ideas about art versus toys, though, I have to ask: do you consider something like M.U.S.C.L.E. or Monster in my Pocket to be art instead of toys? I can anticipate you telling me they have a level of intrinsic playability despite being somewhat solid hunks of rubbery plastic, but I'd like to hear how you describe that playability when points of articulation are absent.

It's an interesting distinction you raise, in any case.

[Blitzwulf]

You and i both but i still demand "good" articulation.

That's one of the things that disappoints me most about Minimates. They look like they have fantastic articulation, which is the one thing I value most highly -- fixing everything about Lego minifigs that I would have wanted -- but then they ruin it with terrible shapes and a generally over-sized figure.

Based on your ideas about art versus toys, though, I have to ask: do you consider something like M.U.S.C.L.E. or Monster in my Pocket to be art instead of toys? I can anticipate you telling me they have a level of intrinsic playability despite being somewhat solid hunks of rubbery plastic, but I'd like to hear how you describe that playability when points of articulation are absent.

It's an interesting distinction you raise, in any case.

The way I see it, all toys began life as someone's art.

Articulation rules. It really, really does, but not with everything. If you want articulation you have to make compromises somewhere, hence the "terrible shapes, and oversized figures." If we could all joint our cool figures up real cheap, without compromising the original sculpt, who wouldn't. The artist's that created M.I.M.P, and M.U.S.C.L.E never intended for those figures to be articulated, in a way, that's what makes them cool, because, even a static figure, a good one can have it's own feeling of movement just sitting there.

"Art is never finished, only abandoned." da Vinci

[asator]

I have to interject here, if I may, for just a second.

I think that it is a little unfair to inply that unarticulated figures make better "art" than "toys". I mean, I think what it really comes down to is a persons imagination. How many of us had "Little People" when we were kids? I had a ton of them and I couldnt tell you how many hours I played with them. Same with M.U.S.C.L.E. figures. They didnt move but they made great toys and for some people, they still do. Like I said, I dont think there is really a "right" or "wrong" way to play, and "playability" is an idea that is very subjective, depending entirely on a person's imagination.

It's like kids with boxes. They're just boxes to some people, to others they are castles or forts or spaceships or any number of things that the mind can create.

But thats just my opinion.

[Articulationnut]

You and i both but i still demand "good" articulation.

That's one of the things that disappoints me most about Minimates. They look like they have fantastic articulation, which is the one thing I value most highly -- fixing everything about Lego minifigs that I would have wanted -- but then they ruin it with terrible shapes and a generally over-sized figure.

Based on your ideas about art versus toys, though, I have to ask: do you consider something like M.U.S.C.L.E. or Monster in my Pocket to be art instead of toys? I can anticipate you telling me they have a level of intrinsic playability despite being somewhat solid hunks of rubbery plastic, but I'd like to hear how you describe that playability when points of articulation are absent.

It's an interesting distinction you raise, in any case.

I agree with your opinion regarding Minimates. Ive mentioned in private conversations with up and coming designers in person as well as online in forums that i really enjoy minimates for what they represent ...not what they are. For those of us that enjoy small action figures (not just small figurines that do not have the ability to be dynamically posed) Minimates opened the door wider than it was prior to a minimate presence in the collectibles market for an above average articulated miniature action figure.

Generally speaking ..prior to mates (and im not counting Lego's here) most 1:24th scale or smaller figures had very limited articulation (7 points was usually the Crème de la Crème) and were almost exclusively packed with a vehicle. With the arrival of minimates people started focusing on the figures in that scale themselves as a stand alone product thanks to the licensing agreements..and started using them with Transformers Alternators as drivers. I think they made some take a 2nd look at this scale and for that im appreciative despite my not caring for the squared look. Even after upgrading my minimates with custom made arms that had swivel biceps they still werent what i wanted from a miniature action figure. I wanted a figure that looked like a person..not a figure that looked squared and resembled a person to a degree.

With regard to the "art vs. toy" question... i think either description can be applied to anything . Rocks are both art and toys Personally... i see MIMP as art first and toys 2nd. 1) They are sculptures of varying quality that depict mythological creatures (are drawings of cthullu art? What about statues of Cthullu? Art or toy? What if cthullu is given a ball jointed tentacle or 2?) 2) They dont have any articulation

..Enjoyable to look at & study about but limited with regard to how much implied "action" they can convey without being forced to use your imagination for everything.

Muscles... toy first art 2nd. They are small sculptures depicting wrestlers/fighters and cartoonish characters that , to my knowledge, dont have a real life historical back ground in the way that mythological creatures have ties to ancient cultures (Vlad the Impaler comes to mind). In addition wrestlers are supposed to be able to ..you know..wrestle. Most fans wanted to reenact an actual match with their toys (id assume ) and did with the little rubber guys but had Kinnikuman been released in a well articulated 1:18th (gi joe) scale i think it would have been successful as well back in the day. Even the Ultimate Muscle 6'' super articulated figures were well received as folks were finally able to put character X in a leg lock using character y. Thats something that they could only imagine as a child.


Thats my opinion ..

Edited by Articulationnut, 19 August 2009 - 09:08 PM.

[dabbuu]

Back to the mini-mates. I hope this is just a stepping stone for the line and it grows to be something so much bigger than the mini-mate line.

But it will wont be if the complainers have their way. They are making a bad impression on both the people at DST and the minimate collectors. Just give the line a chance to see where it goes and hopefully they don't scrap the whole idea due to the naysayers.

My take on this whole 'controversy' is that the re-release is a step in the right direction. At least the license is back in play. Who knows how successful they will be or where they will go from here? Superhero Squad is right there on the shelves next to the Marvel Minimates, I'd love to see some SHS style BB in the future and maybe if we give these a chance (and let their target market buy them if you don't want to) we'll see the license receive a broader span of offerings. I'll wait to see the rest of the line if there is any before making judgment or buying in but regardless of how I feel about the figures themselves, I wish the line the best of luck and hope for its success beyond any of our wildest dreams in the hopes that it branches out and something truly great comes out of it rather than wishing no one picked up the license at all as many of you are, and holding my breath for another 20 years in the hopes that someone else picks up the license down the line should it ever resurface.
-Barry

Exactly!!!

http://www.artasylum...tion/#more-1229

"Luke Porter
Congratulations on securing the Battle Beasts license! Will you be doing all new designs, or will you be re-making some of the classic figures too? Will these all have the basic minimate body underneath their extra parts? Also, are you planning any vehicles or playsets? Thanks for answering our questions!

DSTChuck: Luke I am glad you’re excited! We are too, but it’s too early for some of your questions. Right now the only thing for sure, is the playset will have the Battle Beast you saw at SDCC. Underneath all that YES there remains the same core body that is under all MM.

Sylvain Heyser
Hello Chuck, Please pardon my English. I’m a French people living in New-Caledonia so I guess you will understand me better in bad English than in French. After this great SDCC I finally have my answer at the future of Battle Beast question. But now more and more questions come to my mind. I won’t ask them all to you or you will be afraid and run away quickly. So I will just ask you two things. Can you let us know when do you expect a release of the Battle Beasts Minimates ? Should we wait for the next Con to have more news about this new line or will you published more info in the next months ? I can’t wait to see more figures and to be able to take them in hands. Lastly I would like to let you know that I have plenty of pics or scans from my collection about the old line. Some years ago a Hasbro employee ask me documents and information’s through a American friend. I still have all the scans and pics I did for him and can provide them to you. Those are mainly Japanese and American stuff but include French, Spanish, Italian, Greek, etc. I can also provide you with any information you may need as I collect the old line since its release in France (1987). If you need anything don’t hesitate to ask. I will be more than happy to help at the return of my forever favorite toy line. Keep the good stuff coming - Sylvain Heyser

DSTChuck: Thanks so much for using English, command of that language is hard enough for me, I can’t imagine the struggles I’d have with a foreign language. For right now our plans for Battle Beast are in the very early stages so all I can tell you is the playset will include a Battle Beast and it will be in stores this year. IF all goes according to plan we’ll show some stuff to retailers at the October Toy Show in Dallas (that’s closed to fans and press) and we’ll have a growth and idea of the line after that for say February Toy Fair in NY. Product of some sort would then be on sale at SDCC in 2010. Thanks so much for your offer, we might just take you up on it and I’m so glad we can bring your favorite toy line back to life."

At least someone is trying to help them make improvements

Edited by dabbuu, 20 August 2009 - 03:40 AM.

[garsh]

Boy that conversation went to some really contemplative places. I think all you guys are making great points.

If you want articulation you have to make compromises somewhere, hence the "terrible shapes, and oversized figures."

To this I just can't resist adding that compromises can be balanced, and there are probably golden ratios between sculpt and articulation that suit many of us very differently. For me, I just recently got my hands on some of the new Halo Wars Mega Bloks sets and the little Spartan figures in those are probably my all time favorite figure from any series. The sets themselves leave a little to be desired, as they're probably the poorest quality Mega Bloks sets I've ever bought (and I have a massive collection) but the figures are ideal to me in almost every way. They just nailed the balance for me in sculpt, articulation, proportions and scale. I've never even played Halo so I'm not at all a fan of the license, in case you're wondering if that influences me about them.

As for the Minimates Battle Beasts, if I get any, I don't think they'll suit me to a tee, but they'll be closer than the originals. In this case, I did prefer the old sculpts, but I always felt like I wanted the legs to at least bend, and that's the one thing that prevented me from buying more than about 6 of that original series in my life.

Thanks for all the clarification, Articulationnut. You make it sound like you've put a lot of thought into it.

[dankingery]

i also was intrigued by the halo mega bloks sets, and for the same reason as you. the figures look spectacular. i'm just hoping they sell as well as the rest of the mega bloks lines and i can pick them up at sub-astronomical prices when they hit the clearance aisle.

[garsh]

i also was intrigued by the halo mega bloks sets, and for the same reason as you. the figures look spectacular. i'm just hoping they sell as well as the rest of the mega bloks lines and i can pick them up at sub-astronomical prices when they hit the clearance aisle.

I was planning on picking up one or two small sets and then waiting for the usual rock-bottom clearance discounts Mega Bloks commonly reduce to for anything else, but these are apparently flying off shelves and I had a hard time finding any. It was quite a toy-hunting ordeal last Saturday, and I never did find what I was actually looking for (Warthog and Turret). Since I finally found a handful of sets at Target, I decided I better them while I could, even though they were the more expensive sets that I wasn't previously sure I was going to get at all.

For me, the Hornet was the worst of the bunch in terms of quality. The entire cockpit portion wants to fall right off the main fuselage assembly. The Hawk and Banshee from the Ariel Assault set are both very solid, and use a surprisingly minimal amount of big, pre-fabricated segments in place of regular parts. I think all the sets cost roughly double what they rightfully should.

[Articulationnut]

Yeah...the Mega Bloks HALO mini figures look like they are *almost perfect* with regard to mini figure aesthetics. I plan on buying a set when i hit a store that carries them.

What would make them perfect? If they were the height of old school Battle Beast and boasted a mid bicep swivel.

In fact looking at the Halo Spartan mini figure images just makes me appreciate the original Battle Beast that much more and reminds me of why i was drawn to them.

Muscle bound beast in futuristic armor with weapons Its like rooster fights of the future..or a Michael Vick party.

You shouldnt be able to mess up a simple formula like that. Give the beast a touch of articulation without drastically altering the sculpt and !voila! instant successful toy line. I kid of course (not entirely) as it would take a bit more than that but think about this:

If Lanards The Corps! can succeed for 20+ years with no advertisement of any type then i think $5-7 2 packs of updated Battle Beast would consistently move off of the shelf. Id buy them up like crack after breathing in Spain's air.

[garsh]

Yeah...the Mega Bloks HALO mini figures look like they are *almost perfect* ... If they were the height of old school Battle Beast and boasted a mid bicep swivel.

I see your bicep swivel and I raise you an ankle ball-joint. One of the only tiny things that puts me off is that despite their already really good balance, is there are times when the angle of their fixed ankle makes it impossible for them to stand stable. It's also a little odd that it's impossible for them to stand flat to the ground without having such a wide stance.

Muscle bound beast in futuristic armor with weapons ... Give the beast a touch of articulation without drastically altering the sculpt and !voila! instant successful toy line.

It seems like they define success in very restrictive and demanding terms. If something's not a Ben 10 or better yet Bakugan level phenomenon, it quickly shrivels from shelves, the cartoon gets yanked from TV and the whole franchise crawls away to hide with its tail between its legs. Personally, I've never bought anything from Ben 10 or Bakugan, but I'm not 6. It's sad to me how easy it can be for toy companies to have my money, but I'm such a minority, they don't even care.

But then there are these new niche fillers like Kubrick, Mez-Itz and Minimates. They are going after my wallet, and look how easy! Despite lousy figures and detestable quality standards, I've bought from both of the former brands with disappointment and dissatisfaction, and yet am still planning to try the latter brand despite my revulsion at their fundamental design concept.

[Donkeykid77]

So... 2010...

Hey Dabbuu, would you mind letting them know some of the comments we have on the gator,
feel free to disguise it as constructive criticism,
but they should know on what points the figure NEEDS improvement,

IMO the worst they did were the ultra-skinny looking arms, battle beasts should have firm arms!
Also PLEASE advise them to insert a water/wood/fire emblem and a cool weapon for each figure.

If those 3 things would be changed, that would be a great step in the right direction

DK

PS Or do you have an email-address I could send my 'constructive criticism' to?

PPS I can guarantee I would send them a polite friendly email, not hate-mail!
Despite what has been written in this thread and others, I don't hate minimates,
but I do believe they are seriously lacking (right now) to do the old battle beasts line justice!

[Blitzwulf]

Boy that conversation went to some really contemplative places. I think all you guys are making great points.

If you want articulation you have to make compromises somewhere, hence the "terrible shapes, and oversized figures."

To this I just can't resist adding that compromises can be balanced, and there are probably golden ratios between sculpt and articulation that suit many of us very differently.

I agree with you 100%.

I think it mostly depends on what a toy company is willing to spend on design, and tooling to make their product. The more intricate the design, the more it's going to cost to produce. Here's the difference between good toys, and crap, because it's really the toy execs that have the final say. If they don't think they're going to sell enough to cover the costs, they either simply won't go forward with a line, or start cutting corners. The popularity of a particular license is also going to play a big part in what risks that toy company is willing to take.

Those Halo megabloks figures are amazing, thanks for introducing them to me. I'll be picking up some of those for sure.

[dankingery]

i haven't seen the fast selling of the halo sets yet. they seem to be very abundant here, but i could have always been looking at them right after a restock. i don't always make it to the building sets aisle.

some of the points you've mentioned about what the figures need helps me to know that i'm right to wait. if i'm going to spend money on a playset and really only for the figures. they need to be at a level of quality proportional to the price. figures that don't stand up i think is just about everyone's pet peeve.

[garsh]

Those Halo megabloks figures are amazing, thanks for introducing them to me. I'll be picking up some of those for sure.

I'm glad you're interested! I just hope you like them even a fraction as much as I do.

figures that don't stand up i think is just about everyone's pet peeve.

But they do stand up! Really quite well! I must have given you the wrong impression. The only (very slight) issues are that if you try a really oddball "dynamic" pose, you could have difficulty finding an ideal center of balance. And the other thing is that when standing perfectly upright, they have the exact width of one Lego-sized stud of a gap between their feet, and you can't close that gap in a way that looks at all convincing, because their ankles have a slight tilt, so when their feet come too close together, the soles of their feet don't touch the ground where their arches would be. That's not really a huge deal, but it's just a very tiny issue that I think makes them less that 100% perfect figures. If you're worried about price, though, and they're on store shelves where you live, you probably should wait.

By the way, I don't know if this is important to anyone else, but the only UNSC (human good guys) weapons I have that came in my three sets are long rifles, which I think are far over-sized. Not only are the barrels so long that the gun is nearly exactly as long as the figure is tall, but the stock sets so far back that you can't pose them with any really reasonable two-handed grip, which is exactly what you want to do with a rifle.

When I got home from work about 45 minutes ago, I found my delivery from Toywiz.com of some unofficial HALO guns (and a few others) manufactured by Brickarms.com. They're better in every possible way, though pricey and still don't make for a good two-hand pose.

http://www.toywiz.co...saultrifle.html
http://www.toywiz.com/bam6magnum.html
(I ordered some of these, too, at the same time, just because of the awesome factor):
http://www.toywiz.co...pulserifle.html
http://www.toywiz.co...antblaster.html

[Articulationnut]

You can pick up a HALO mini figure for $4 usd shipped on the megabloks website.

Yes im serious.

And i agree with you Veers. Regardless of the aesthetics of the actual toy...its a good business decision . There is very little risk.

[dankingery]

2 figs at that price would be more reasonable.

[greedo216]

Hello everybody, I've been around for a while, but I never post. I thought on this subject though, I'd throw my 2 cents in. First off, I'm not a fan of the new line based on what I've seen so far. I don't feel it's fair to pass judgement though based on one prototype. I will have to wait and see what else they issue. If I don't like them, I'm not gonna buy them.

Still, I have to appreciate the fact that a toy company is willing to take a chance on a moderatly succesful toy line that has been dead for 20+ years. If the other toy lines felt that bringing these figures back would be succesful to their buissness, then someone woud have beat d.s. to the punch. Ultimately, a company is gonna do what they feel is gonna bring in the most profit regardless on how a few vintage collectors feel.

Lastly, I dont think, no matter how good/bad the figures are they will never be the same as the ones that we had when we were kids. Because the product has been dead for so long, we will always compare them to the originals. No matter how good/bad they may be, they will never compare. They will never bring us back to the place we were when we first saw then in the store or the excitement we had when we first opened them. This is just my opion though.

[garsh]

...I dont think, no matter how good/bad the figures are they will never be the same as the ones that we had when we were kids. ... They will never bring us back to the place we were when we first saw then in the store or the excitement we had when we first opened them.

I dunno, man. Personally, I think I'm actually more excited about the new line, and especially about its potential. So far we've just seen that one gator, and while I like him okay (except, of course, for the inherent Minimates drawbacks we've beaten to death already) I'm more excited to see what others will be like. The biggest deal to me, is like I was saying: the possibility of swapping out armor or even limbs to build a character just the way you want it. Beyond just the supreme Minimates articulation, that's something the original series could never have offered, and it's a huge advantage to me. If that's how it turns out, it pretty much makes the originals obsolete for me by contrast.

[Venom]

I was gone for a long time, I'm back now and how my collection has grown. I'm thrilled to see that they are releasing a new BB line.It was about time!! I have already pre-orded my base set.
Venom
whats up TGB