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Opening up Muscle 4 Pack secrets!


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#1 Universal Ruler Supreme

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Posted 25 July 2007 - 03:29 PM

As some can recall, a number of months earlier this year I agreed to take on the task of breaking down the information I could gather from the packing of figures in 4 Packs! However I greatly underestimated the size of that little project! Nicely Jkaris provided me with pics of his many 4 Packs to try and figure something out! Unfortunately as helpful as that was, I still could not gather enough information to really get anywhere! I didn't really know what else to do, So I've decided to gather a huge assortment of 4 pack information from YOU My fellow board members! It might be pretty crazy! It might be pretty silly! It might have something to do about that nasty feeling in my gut I get when I read one of Doc's post, but alas it must be done! So here is the plan. Whether you are a muscle collector or not, whether you have 1 4 pack to your name or 100, I need you to do one of a few things! Either kindly send me the packaging contents of your 4 packs, or some good enough quality pictures that I can determine their contents myself. However just a gobbled up group of numbers of each figure in your 4 packs is not enough! I will need info from each 4 pack combination! Including of course FLESH, HALF&HALF, and COLORED! So if you decide to send me just the contents of a 4 pack, I need to either know that the pack is a flesh pack, or what color each figure is. So if you just send pics, it's easier on you, and if you send numbers it's easier on me.:) The choice is your's and all help and assistance is highly appreciated! Also I don't check eBay for muscles as often as I used to, so when anybody finds an auction of 4 packs kindly post the link here! Infact ALL information, pictures included can be directly posted in this thread, however you can send them directly to me as well, or just reference me to any website where you may have your pictures stored. I don't know how long this project will take, or how long it will be before I get any results, but still it will give me something to do on my down time. :p

What I hope to discover from this information.

1. The figure placement for each pack type.
2. The exclusivity of figures between 4 and 28 packs
3. The change in color of each 'TREE' of figures between Half/Half packs, and full color packs.
4. To determine what trees were made in color or flesh in Half/Half packs, and if it is consistent throughout.
5. If that nasty bump will ever go away.
6. If there were any noticeable changes in the exclusivity of figures between 4 and 28 packs depending on each package combination.
7. How often colors change throughout the life span of colored 4 packs.
8. Who knows what else I may find! any suggestions or ideas are extremely welcomed!

My current goal is to amass information from at least 200 of each 4 pack combination! So I will currently need 600 4 packs of information to see if I have gotten anywhere. That's a total of 2400 figures! This number could fluctuate depending on the variety of information I receive. When I achieve enough information, I will compile, and overlap this info to see what I get!

Flesh packs = Need to know each figure included.

Half/Half Packs = Need to know each Flesh Figure, as well as each colored figure and the colors of each.

Colored Packs = Each figure and their color.

Thanks beforehand to each person who can contribute.

Please don't get mad at me if I get exhausted from time to time with this project, I'm in no hurry, and quite frankly muscles aren't going anywhere anytime soon. If at some point I feel I can no longer carry on this project, I will find someone capable to take over all the information.



Current Contributors! Thanks guys! :)

JKaris
Bellatrix101
Soupie

Edited by Universal Ruler Supreme, 25 July 2007 - 07:00 PM.

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#2 Universal Ruler Supreme

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Posted 25 July 2007 - 03:36 PM

Please only post information that may be helpful to this project! :) If you'd like to debate the information at hand feel free to join us in this thread! http://www.littlerub...d...c=20489&hl=

Would it be too much trouble to pin this topic? :)

Edited by Universal Ruler Supreme, 25 July 2007 - 03:37 PM.

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#3 Soupie

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Posted 25 July 2007 - 06:40 PM

(1) 50/50 4-Pack

Serial # 74299 02637

# 208 Flesh - Part 19 Tree 2 <---
# 056 Flesh - Part 13 Tree 2

# 139 Dark Blue - Part 11 Tree 1
# 220 Red - Part 1 Tree 1

(2) 50/50 4-Pack

Serial # 74299 02637

# 151 Flesh - Part 8 Tree 1
# 215 Flesh - Part 20 Tree 1

# 141 Dark Blue - Part 10 Tree 2
# 187 Purple - Part 18 Tree 2


(3) All Color 4-Pack

Serial # 74299 02637

# 197 Orange - Part 19 Tree 2 <---
# 100 Light Blue - Part 7 Tree 4

# 042 Dark Blue - Part 17 Tree 1
# 167 Green - Part 15 Tree 2

Wow, pretty much all over the place! The only repeat I see is Part 19 Tree 2. However, the part is used in a 50/50 pack (Flesh) and an All-Color pack (Orange). I'd be interested to see if they use a Red, Dark Blue, or Purple figure for a 50/50 pack and then use a non-RBP figure for an All-Color pack from the same part.

:)

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#4 General Veers

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Posted 26 July 2007 - 04:18 AM

Would it be too much trouble to pin this topic? :)

Let’s not pin it, I think it might get lost or forgotten about. Let’s just bump it every so often, we need to keep it in the spotlight!
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#5 Universal Ruler Supreme

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Posted 29 July 2007 - 01:11 AM

Alright! Some major developments in my project! Keep in mind that it's nearly 5 a.m. and I've been working on this since midnight. :(

1. The figure placement for each pack type.

With just the info I currently have on each pack, there at current doesn't seem to be any difference in the figure placement of each pack. Aside from a few abnormalities which I will research later.

2. The exclusivity of figures between 4 and 28 packs
They are completely Exclusive! I havn't found a single figure from a 28 pack in any of the hundred or so 4packs I've seen. All 28 pack figures were just that, 28 pack figures. In all the 4pack info I've gathered I have found Every other muscle excluding the 28 pack figures in the 4packs, with exception of 5. Those 5 are from trees that I have found other figures from already, so it is a given that these were also 4pack figures.

3. The change in color of each 'TREE' of figures between Half/Half packs, and full color packs.

Appears rather random. There were many figures still made in the same colors as Halfpacks, but then there were immense changes in color patterns with others. May need more research.

4. To determine what trees were made in color or flesh in Half/Half packs, and if it is consistent throughout.
Interestingly, With the Half pack info I have, there doesn't seem to be any split in figures made in flesh or color. I have found that Most of the flesh figures have color versions throughout Half packs. Which means it wasn't as hard as we thought it would be for them to switch up colors, and they were still making fleshies with R/B/P figs, or the fleshies were simply oldstock packed with new colors. At the moment It could be either.

5. If that nasty bump will ever go away.
It Went away! :o

6. If there were any noticeable changes in the exclusivity of figures between 4 and 28 packs depending on each package combination.
This question is moot.

7. How often colors change throughout the life span of colored 4 packs.
Even with the majority of colored 4packs being ones from Jkaris, there seems to be a rather average change in color of each figure. Many were repeats, but there were changes. Needs more research. A whole case of 4packs might actually come in handy.

8. Who knows what else I may find! any suggestions or ideas are extremely welcomed!

I have a sealed 10 pack, and every figure in it were also 4pack figures. Aside from the abnormalities I mention seeing in question 1, I believe 10 packs and 4pack contents were completely the same, and any Super Rares would probably have been found in either.

Edited by Universal Ruler Supreme, 29 July 2007 - 01:21 AM.

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#6 Soupie

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Posted 29 July 2007 - 07:05 AM

2. The exclusivity of figures between 4 and 28 packs
They are completely Exclusive! I havn't found a single figure from a 28 pack in any of the hundred or so 4packs I've seen. All 28 pack figures were just that, 28 pack figures. In all the 4pack info I've gathered I have found Every other muscle excluding the 28 pack figures in the 4packs, with exception of 5. Those 5 are from trees that I have found other figures from already, so it is a given that these were also 4pack figures.

Cool, now we can state the hypothesis that 4-packs should not contain 28-pack sculpts. I know I'll be checking all 4-packs I come across from now on. (Eventually, I'm going to set up a page of the MCIA with the trees arranged by the 28-packs.)

I'm a little confused by the last part. Are you saying you have found at least 5 sculpts that do come in 28-packs in the 4-packs? You say they belong to multiple trees -- how many trees and which are they? Finally, you say you have "found other figures from" these trees. Found them where?

4. To determine what trees were made in color or flesh in Half/Half packs, and if it is consistent throughout.
Interestingly, With the Half pack info I have, there doesn't seem to be any split in figures made in flesh or color. I have found that Most of the flesh figures have color versions throughout Half packs. Which means it wasn't as hard as we thought it would be for them to switch up colors, and they were still making fleshies with R/B/P figs, or the fleshies were simply oldstock packed with new colors. At the moment It could be either.

So what your saying is that you found the same sculpt in, say, Flesh, Red, Dark Blue, and Purple throughout the 4-packs? That makes sense to me, I don't see why you wouldn't. Obviously, if the sculpt wasn't made in one of those colors, you wouldn't.

One interesting thing I found by going of the MUSCLE Parts, was that no tree is missing all three of the following colors: Purple, Dark Blue, and Red. In all cases, at least one of those colors was present in a tree. This is another little factoid that leads me to think there were three waves.

Nice work!
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#7 Kevin Mayle

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Posted 29 July 2007 - 07:43 AM

Just to throw a bit of my info into the ring, I bought a hundred sealed 4 Packs in 1997 and none of them had 28 Pack figures either.
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#8 Universal Ruler Supreme

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Posted 29 July 2007 - 10:24 AM

Cool, now we can state the hypothesis that 4-packs should not contain 28-pack sculpts. I know I'll be checking all 4-packs I come across from now on. (Eventually, I'm going to set up a page of the MCIA with the trees arranged by the 28-packs.)

I'm a little confused by the last part. Are you saying you have found at least 5 sculpts that do come in 28-packs in the 4-packs? You say they belong to multiple trees -- how many trees and which are they? Finally, you say you have "found other figures from" these trees. Found them where?


Oh sorry. There are 112 28 pack figures. I found the remaining 121 figures with the exception of 5 in the 4packs. However I found figures from the trees that these 5 belong to in 4packs, so they were 4pack figures as well.

So what your saying is that you found the same sculpt in, say, Flesh, Red, Dark Blue, and Purple throughout the 4-packs? That makes sense to me, I don't see why you wouldn't. Obviously, if the sculpt wasn't made in one of those colors, you wouldn't.

One interesting thing I found by going of the MUSCLE Parts, was that no tree is missing all three of the following colors: Purple, Dark Blue, and Red. In all cases, at least one of those colors was present in a tree. This is another little factoid that leads me to think there were three waves.

Nice work!


Exactly! It practically decimates Veers theory that all colors were made at the same time.
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#9 General Veers

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Posted 30 July 2007 - 07:15 AM

Exactly! It practically decimates Veers theory that all colors were made at the same time.

I wouldn’t say “decimates.” Geez. :p

In an attempt not to hijack this thread again, my response is over here.

Edited by General Veers, 30 July 2007 - 07:18 AM.

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#10 General Veers

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Posted 29 June 2009 - 05:27 AM

7. How often colors change throughout the life span of colored 4 packs.
Even with the majority of colored 4packs being ones from Jkaris, there seems to be a rather average change in color of each figure. Many were repeats, but there were changes. Needs more research. A whole case of 4packs might actually come in handy.

Hey URS, do you still have the breakdowns of the figures in each 4-pack?

I was doing some writing for my History 100 section on 4-packs and I'm trying to list out each of the possible color combinations. Did you find a certain number of combinations?

Right now, I figure its:
All Flesh
2 Flesh, Purple, Red
2 Flesh, Blue, Red
2 Flesh, Purple, Blue
And then 70 possible color combinations - but did 70 of them really happen?

EDIT - And have we ever actually seen a color 4-pack with the poster offer? I searched the board, so it looks like the answer is still no.

Edited by General Veers, 29 June 2009 - 05:46 AM.

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#11 Universal Ruler Supreme

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Posted 29 June 2009 - 06:11 AM

I'm not exactly sure this is what your looking for, but the original plan of that question was to see if any colors were produced at a certain time.

For instance I was trying to see if after the "Half/Half" packs, if there were any other Kind of colored half packs. Say like they weren't yet producing Salmon figures....Were there cases of Colored packs without salmon or orange, before there were fully mixed color packs with those 2 colors finally being made.

There is no real way of determining that unless a sealed 4 pack case with certain colors completely missing shows up. However I don't think this was the case anyway. I think after the Half packs that all 8 colors were being made.

But I think what you are asking is if there were specific combinations of colored and half packs?

There are no known examples in my information where Half packs contain 3 colored figs. They were always 2flesh/2color, and the 2 colors were never the same, and were always either combos of red/db db/purp red/purp.

Colored packs were completely random in color combinations, but no known four pack in my info had 2 of the same color.

So any color would show up with any other 3 different colors in a 4 pack.

G R LB DB O S M P
G x + + + + + + +

R + x + + + + + +

LB + + x + + + + +

DB + + + x + + + +

O + + + + x + + +

S + + + + + x + +

M + + + + + + x +

P + + + + + + + x

Edited by Universal Ruler Supreme, 29 June 2009 - 06:14 AM.

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#12 General Veers

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Posted 29 June 2009 - 06:14 AM

So any color would show up with any other 3 different colors in a 4 pack.

That's what I thought, and that's what I was looking for. Thanks! :)
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#13 Ridureyu

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Posted 26 July 2011 - 07:36 PM

So, are the 4-packs always four pieces from four separate trees/parts?

What about 10-packs, then?
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