26 replies to this topic

[doc_moore_j]

I was thinking about this last night, while working on the MPS competition. For all of you (myself really soon) who have a full set of Muscles. Do you really consider your set to be complete with all of these rares surfacing? I am sure several years ago, one might say he had a complete set of 233, then Satan cross, and the muscle ring variations came out. So people started thinking wait I don't have a full set yet, now they claim to have one after they get 236. All of a sudden the Black Hole Sunshine surfaces, and maybe more to follow. When will it end. So my question to you guys is, do you consider your set complete if you do not have a black hole sunshine, knowing that it appears to be a legit Muscle? I don't have one myself, not sure how much I'd be willing to pay, sometimes ebay is spur of the moment.
Also off the subject, but have any of you seen Satan cross in any other colors besides flesh? Just wondering.

[arforbes]

I consider any set with all 236 M.U.S.C.L.E. Figures, a complete set. Since the two exclusive Wrestling Ring figures are pretty common, they need to be included. And Satancross, he has showed up quite a bit and needs to be an addition to the collection also.

This is how I look at it, if you have all 233, then you have a complete poster collection. If you have all 236, then you have a complete poster + rares collection. If you have all 236 + an Ashuraman and a Blackhole Sunshine, then you have a SUPER RARE collection.

However a SUPER RARE collection is right now impossible and no one that I know of owns one. I only own all 236 + an Ashuraman, so I have only half of a SUPER RARE collection. I suppose the owner of the Blackhole Sunshine has only half of a SUPER RARE collection also, because he does not own an Ashuraman.

As far as I know, these are the only M.U.S.C.L.E. Figures out there. Only three Ashuraman are know to exist, and only one Blackhole Sunshine is known to exist. There's got to be more out there, we just have to find them!!!

[Tortle]

I think your question depends on if you think that the "rares" are legitimate MUSCLEs. I'm of the opinion that there are so many Kinnikuman and bootlegs in circulation that for me to call a figure a MUSCLE it has to be either shown on the poster or confirmed in MUSCLE packaging. That's not to say that the spinning head Ashuraman and Blackhole Sunshine aren't legitimate MUSCLEs, but I think they need to be proven as such first.

Otherwise I end up doing what I did before with the Futuristic Goalie and the little Lightbulb guy: looking endlessly on Ebay auctions for the figure, despite the fact that they aren't real MUSCLEs (in that case, they were Ramenman and Kinnikuman figures, respectively).

Since there are 233 MUSCLEs on the poster, and the two Wrestling figures and Satan Cross have been confirmed in MUSCLE packaging, I would consider my collection of 236 fleshies to be complete. For now.

-Nathan

[arforbes]

Nathan,

The Ashuraman is a legit M.U.S.C.L.E. From M.U.S.C.L.E. Head to M.U.S.C.L.E. Head, trust me, he's as real as it gets. I own one. Check out the Collection Pics section. He is real and is made of M.U.S.C.L.E. plastic. Serious as a heart attack.

[jkaris]

I'd say 235 is complete.
235 +1 (S.C.) is just owning a novelty (you could call it a Super complete).
Same with any of the Super Rares.
My guess is that there are 3 more super rares to be found (the remainder from Kinnikuman part 21) but you never know.
I doubt that they're in any color other than pink.
But still, I'd say 233+2 was complete.

[arforbes]

Also off the subject, but have any of you seen Satan cross in any other colors besides flesh? Just wondering.

To answer your question, no, I have never seen a Satancross in color. However, the possibility exists that he was made as a color, since the colors came out after the feshies, and Satancross was made as a fleshy.

I'm still waiting for the day when someone finds a colored Satancross in a M.U.S.C.L.E. 4-Pack or a M.U.S.C.L.E. 10-Pack. Read my post under Sightings in the section about the 10-Packs at Toybliss, about the dream I had about the M.U.S.C.L.E. Toy Store. It's crazy, but I just have this feeling!!!

[Tortle]

The Ashuraman is a legit M.U.S.C.L.E. From M.U.S.C.L.E. Head to M.U.S.C.L.E. Head, trust me, he's as real as it gets. I own one. Check out the Collection Pics section. He is real and is made of M.U.S.C.L.E. plastic. Serious as a heart attack. [mellow.gif]

I dunno... heart attacks can be pretty funny, depending on the person who's having it. I mean, if Osama Bin Laden had a heart attack on television, it would be the comedy hit of the summer!

Anyway, back to Ashuraman... I do believe everyone who says that he's very similar to MUSCLEs, and the evidence supporting his MUSCLEness is pretty strong. But like I said, those other super-rares seemed legitimate too. So I think I'll wait until I have some more evidence (like see him in MUSCLE packaging) before I try to get one, or endorse it as legitimate on my site. Of course, if I endorsed everything as a legit MUSCLE that everybody throughout the years said was a "super-rare" MUSCLE, my site's credability would be basically nill.

Anyway, no offense or anything ... it's probably a MUSCLE but even if it's not, it's still a great figure!

-Nathan

[arforbes]

My guess is that there are 3 more super rares to be found (the remainder from Kinnikuman part 21) but you never know.
I doubt that they're in any color other than pink.
But still, I'd say 233+2 was complete.

Ahhh, you make an interesting point, Johnny. It is conceivable that the figures from Kinnikuman Part 21 #'s 293, 300, & 304 were made into M.U.S.C.L.E.'s also. Or did Mattel make the ones from Part 23, #'s 318, 319, & 320? The ones with two parts, like Satancross, Ashuraman, and Blackhole Sunshine. Or did they make all the Kinnikuman with two parts into M.U.S.C.L.E.?

Dammit Mattel, TELL US!!!!!!!!!!

[Adamantiumwulf]

well if you are going to include the wrestling ring figures what about the board game figures. 6 (5 grape and terribull ) of them you could only get from the boardgame. They arent flesh granted but the board game is not hard to come by.

So can you have a complete set without them?

If we are just talking flesh colored. Then a complete set would be 234. the 233 poster figures and satan cross which could be found in regular 4 packs.

Only figures that came in the traditional packaging (4 pack, 10 pack, 28 pack)should be considered. The wrestling ring figures are just a bonus.

[Beligerant1]

I agree with johnny, if you include the wrestling ring figures you have to include the board game figures. They arent a part of a complete FLESH set, but I think to say you have a complete set of muscles you would have to have them because they are different from the other regular colors in that theres only five of them and they are not as easy to get. (by the way, i have an extra three of the purples and two of the greens from the board game if anybody is looking for some of these figures). I also think that satancross has to be part of a complete collection because he is actually fairly common, proven in packaging, and has such high notoriety among the other muscles.

[Tortle]

if you include the wrestling ring figures you have to include the board game figures.

Hm... I hadn't thought of that. For a complete collection, I would normally only consider figures that have unique sculpts. So that means the wrestling ring figures would be included, but not the board game figures. But the board game figures are unique (if not the green ones, the grape ones definitely are), so I guess a complete set would also have to include the grape ones as well.

Although, I'm avoiding getting into the multi-colors too much. It was a pretty massive task for Jimmy in determining which MUSCLEs were available in which colors, and who knows if his is even a complete list! (In case anybody's wondering, the list is shown at
Jimmy's MUSCLE Color List.) And it would be a complete nightmare collecting them all...

-Nathan

[NamaNiku]

I do not think that the Black Hole Sunshine is part of the M.U.S.C.L.E. line. I think that it made its way over here from Japan. I am currently trying to get one from Yahoo Japan auctions. I will take arforbes word on the ashuraman.

[jkaris]

I do not think that the Black Hole Sunshine is part of the M.U.S.C.L.E. line. I think that it made its way over here from Japan. I am currently trying to get one from Yahoo Japan auctions. I will take arforbes word on the ashuraman.

I think he's a legit MUSCLE. I have the word of the past 2 owners who say he is exactly the same plastic/texture/color and smell(Yes, he's smells the same Corey) as MUSCLE's. So I'm convinced. I'm just pissed that I lost that auction.

[arforbes]

Hey Beligerant1,

Could you post a pic of the extra Colored M.U.S.C.L.E. Figures from the Mega-Match Game that you have? I may be interested if they are the ones I need! Thanks.

[Beligerant1]

I cant put a picture up right now cuase im on the wrong computer but i can tell you which numbers they are. I have the purple 149, 152, & 154 and the green 178 & 235 (terribull). they are all in great condition, no marks or anything.

[NamaNiku]

Okay, I believe you guys. It was just a theory..... there are a couple of BH Sunshine on Yahoo Japan right now, but they are a see-through blue color... really cool stuff. There is also an ashuraman with a missing head in the same lot.... tragic young chap

[arforbes]

I have an Ashuraman, and trust me, he looks, feels, smells, and is a M.U.S.C.L.E. I have never been so sure of anything! 100% M.U.S.C.L.E. and I also beleive the same about the Balckhole Sunshine. Johnny has me convinced. Go to his site, it will tell you the story, and you'll believe!!!

http://jk.ixystems.c...uscle/rares.htm

[jkaris]

I wonder if the kinnikuman kinkeshi figures that have removeable parts, if they are made out of a different plastic than the rest.

Same rubber. I have a BHS minus chest piece and the back piece to S.C. in green.

[arforbes]

Holy crap Johnny,

You have a BHS Kinnikuman!!! Could you post a pic of him? I've never seen one besides on that Japanese Kinnikuman site. That would be GREAT!

[Beligerant1]

actually, since you bring up kinkeshi it made me think about the pack i have of two painted kinkeshi. They came with a bonus figure. The bonus figure was a non-painted flesh color figure that had all the classic marks of a muscle figure ysnt and whatnot and was made of a hard plastic, actually just a little harder than regular muscles. A big difference is that the color of the plastic is much lighter than the flesh color of our muscles, ill have to put a picture up when i get a chance to show you the difference. But from the look of the pictures of ashuraman and bhs, they are more like our muscle than kinkeshi.

[jkaris]

They came with a bonus figure. The bonus figure was a non-painted flesh color figure that had all the classic marks of a muscle figure ysnt and whatnot and was made of a hard plastic, actually just a little harder than regular muscles. A big difference is that the color of the plastic is much lighter than the flesh color of our muscles.

Yeah the remakes were a more MUSCLE-like plastic. A little more translucent, but harder nonetheless. These came out within the last couple of years. You can get pictures of them over in the kinnikuman bible thread in the links section. They only made part of the set, not all.

[Tortle]

I've never seen one besides on that Japanese Kinnikuman site.

There's a post with a link above, but I thought I'd reprint the website anyway:

http://jk.ixystems.c...uscle/rares.htm

And I second the notion for Johnny to post a picture of his BH Sunshine. I'm just interested in seeing more of the figure!

-Nathan

[arforbes]

I cant put a picture up right now cuase im on the wrong computer but i can tell you which numbers they are. I have the purple 149, 152, & 154 and the green 178 & 235 (terribull). they are all in great condition, no marks or anything.

Beligerant1,

I am interested in purchasing these figures from you, or if you'd like to trade for figures, I have a bunch of extras, just let me know and we'll work something out!

[jkaris]

Well, I can't find my BHS (he's buried somewhere in a box), so I'll post pics of him when I dig him up. But I took some picks of the S.C. back. Here ya go:

Attached Files

•  scback.jpg   9.78K   7 downloads

[Tortle]

Has anybody won an auction through Yahoo Japan? I'm wondering if the sellers would ship to the US. I suppose it would depend on the seller, although how do you know if the seller even speaks English?

-Nathan